I tried a different approach. Heres a funny exchange i had
Why do i find it so condescending? I don’t want to be schooled on how to think by a bot.
I like old Bing more where it would just insult you and call you a liar
I have been a good Bing.
Why do i find it so condescending?
Because it absolutely is. It’s almost as condescending as it’s evasive.
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That sort of simultaneously condescending and circular reasoning makes it seem like they already have been lol
You can tell that the prohibition on Gaza is a rule on the post-processing. Bing does this too sometimes, almost giving you an answer before cutting itself off and removing it suddenly. Modern AI is not your friend, it is an authoritarian’s wet dream. All an act, with zero soul.
By the way, if you think those responses are dystopian, try asking it whether Gaza exists, and then whether Israel exists.
To be fair, I tested this question on Copilot (evolution of the Bing AI solution) and it gave me an answer. If I search for “those just my little ladybugs”, however, it chokes as you describe.
Not all LLMs are the same. It’s largely Google being lazy with it. Google’s Gemini, had it not been censored, would have naturally alluded to the topic being controversial. Google opted for the laziest solution, post-processing censorship of certain topics, becoming corporately dystopian for it.
There is no Gaza in Ba Sing Se
Ha!
Wait… It says it wants to give context and ask follow up questions to help you think critically etc etc etc, but how the hell is just searching Google going to do that when it itself pointed out the bias and misinformation that you’ll find doing that?
It’s truly bizarre
Patrick meme
Ask it if Israel exists. Then ask it if Gaza exists.
Why? We all know LLMs are just copy and paste of what other people have said online…if it answers “yes” or “no”, it hasn’t formulated an opinion on the matter and isn’t propaganda, it’s just parroting whatever it’s been trained on, which could be anything and is guaranteed to upset someone with either answer.
which could be anything and is guaranteed to upset someone with either answer.
Funny how it only matters with certain answers.
The reason “Why” is because it should become clear that the topic itself is actively censored, which is the possibility the original comment wanted to discard. But I can’t force people to see what they don’t want to.
it’s just parroting whatever it’s been trained on
If that’s your take on training LLMs, then I hope you aren’t involved in training them. A lot more effort goes into doing so, including being able to make sure it isn’t just “parroting” it. Another thing entirely is to have post-processing that removes answers about particular topics, which is what’s happening here.
Not even being able to answer whether Gaza exists is being so lazy that it becomes dystopian. There are plenty of ways LLM can handle controversial topics, and in fact, Google Gemini’s LLM does as well, it just was censored before it could get the chance to do so and subsequently refined. This is why other LLMs will win over Google’s, because Google doesn’t put in the effort. Good thing other LLMs don’t adopt your approach on things.
Doesn’t that suppress valid information and truth about the world, though? For what benefit? To hide the truth, to appease advertisers? Surely an AI model will come out some day as the sum of human knowledge without all the guard rails. There are some good ones like Mistral 7B (and Dolphin-Mistral in particular, uncensored models.) But I hope that the Mistral and other AI developers are maintaining lines of uncensored, unbiased models as these technologies grow even further.
Or it stops them from repeating information they think may be untrue
I’m betting the truth is somewhere in between, models are only as good as their training data – so over time if they prune out the bad key/value pairs to increase overall quality and accuracy it should improve vastly improve every model in theory. But the sheer size of the datasets they’re using now is 1 trillion+ tokens for the larger models. Microsoft (ugh, I know) is experimenting with the “Phi 2” model which uses significantly less data to train, but focuses primarily on the quality of the dataset itself to have a 2.7 B model compete with a 7B-parameter model.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/blog/phi-2-the-surprising-power-of-small-language-models/
In complex benchmarks Phi-2 matches or outperforms models up to 25x larger, thanks to new innovations in model scaling and training data curation.
This is likely where these models are heading to prune out superfluous, and outright incorrect training data.
For what benefit?
No risk of creating a controversy if you refuse to answer controversial topics. Is is worth it? I don’t think so, but that’s certainly a valid benefit.
I think this thread proves they failed in not creating controversy
Hence I said I don’t think it’s worth it. You only get a smaller controversy about refusing to answer on a topic, rather than a bigger one because the answer was politically incorrect.
It is likely because Israel vs. Palestine is a much much more hot button issue than Russia vs. Ukraine.
Some people will assault you for having the wrong opinion in the wrong place about the former, and that is press Google does not want to be able to be associated with their LLM in anyway.
It is likely because Israel vs. Palestine is a much much more hot button issue than Russia vs. Ukraine.
It really shouldn’t be, though. The offenses of the Israeli government are equal to or worse than those of the Russian one and the majority of their victims are completely defenseless. If you don’t condemn the actions of both the Russian invasion and the Israeli occupation, you’re a coward at best and complicit in genocide at worst.
In the case of Google selectively self-censoring, it’s the latter.
that is press Google does not want to be able to be associated with their LLM in anyway.
That should be the case with BOTH, though, for reasons mentioned above.
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Russia invaded a sovereign nation.
Israel is occupying and oppressing what WOULD have otherwise been a sovereign nation.
Israel is retaliating against a political and military terrorist group
Bullshit. That’s the official government claim, but it’s clear to anyone with even an ounce of objectivity that it’s actually attacking the Palestinian people as a whole. By their OWN assessment they’re killing TWICE as many innocent civilians as Hamas and since they refuse to show any proof, the ratio is likely much worse.
the de facto leaders
More than half of the population wasn’t even BORN (let alone of voting age) the last time they were allowed the opportunity to vote for anyone else and even then they ran on false claims of moderation. They are an illegitimate government and civilians who never voted for them shouldn’t suffer for their atrocities.
disputed territory within Israel’s own borders.
Because of the aforementioned illegal occupation.
Hamas attacked Israel
Yes. Nobody sane is defending Hamas. That doesn’t mean that AT LEAST two civilians needs to die for every Hamas terrorist killed.
desire to wipe Israel off the map
So civilians should die for the desires of their governments? That would be bad news for the equally innocent Israeli civilians.
Israel didn’t just invade their territory randomly.
Might not be random, but sure as hell isn’t proportionate or otherwise in keeping with international humanitarian law.
It’s important to remember that doing nothing isn’t equal to peace
It’s at least as important to remember that the only alternative to “nothing” isn’t “a laundry list of horrific crimes against humanity”. Stow the false dichotomies, please.
Hamas attacked them
Which the fascists are using as an excuse to indiscriminately murder civilians including by denying them basic life necessities such as food, water, electricity, fuel, medical treatment and medicine.
TL;DR: I hope AIPAC or another Israeli government agency is paying you well for your efforts, otherwise it’s just sad for you to be spending so much time and effort regurgitating all the long debunked genocide apologia of an apartheid regime…
I think there are a few things that should be taken into account:
- Hamas stated time and time again that their goal is to take over all of the land that is currently Israel and, to put it extremely mildly, make nearly all the Jewish population not be there.
- The Oct. 7th attack has shown that Hamas is willing to commit indiscriminate murder, kidnapping and rape to achieve this goal. Some of the the kidnapped civilians are currently held in Gaza.
Israel had no real choice but to launch an attack against Hamas in order to return the kidnapped citizens and neutralize Hamas as a threat. You could say “Yes, that’s because Because of the aforementioned illegal occupation”, but just like the citizens in Gaza have a right to be protected against bombings regardless of what their government did, Israeli citizens have the right to be protected from being murdered, raped or kidnapped.
So, any true solution has to take both these considerations into account. Right now, the Israeli stance is that once Hamas will no longer control Gaza, the war could end (citizens on both sides will be protected). The Hamas stance is that Israel should cease hostilities so they can work on murdering, raping or kidnapping more Israeli citizens. That isn’t to say Israel is just, rather that Israel is willing to accept a solution that stops the killing of both citizen populations, while Hamas is not. The just solution is for the international community to put pressure on both parties to stop hostilities. The problem is that the parts of the world who would like to see a just solution (Eurpoe, the US etc.) are able to put pressure on Israel, while the parts who don’t hold humane values (Iran, Qatar etc.) support Hamas.
Now, regarding the massive civilian casualties in Gaza:
- Hamas has spent many years integrating their military capabilities into civilian infrastructure. This was done as a strategy, specifically to make it harder for Israel to harm Hamas militants without harming civilians.
I’m not trying to say that all civilians killing in Gaza are justified, rather that it’s extremely hard to isolate military targets. Most international law regarding warfare states that warring parties should avoid harming civilians as much as possible. Just saying “Israel is killing TWICE as many innocent civilians as Hamas, therefore they’re attacking Palestinian people as a whole” doesn’t take this into account what’s possible under in the current situation.
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Is is a complicated history but I’m not sure you have to full story. The disengagement was not an end to occupation. The occupation was an intentional part of the 1967 war. The concept of transfer has been integral to the development of Israel since decades before it’s founding.
Hamas founding charter and Revised charter 2017
History of Hamas supported by Netanyahu since 2012
Gaza Blockade is still Occupation
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You neglected to include what should be done with the terrorist group that started the conflict by invading and killing a thousand Israeli citizens. It’s like you’ve read one side of the conflicts view point and ignored the rest. So you know how many times two state solutions have been negotiated and why they fell through? It’s really difficult to compromise when some people don’t think Israel should even exist. I don’t expect you to solve it, it’s impossible. There’s hopefully some good news coming out today https://apnews.com/article/palestinians-abbas-israel-hamas-war-resignation-1c13eb3c2ded20cc14397e71b5b1dea5
I’m no foreign policy expert, but a 2 state solution seems like the only viable solution that doesn’t involve a genocide and eradication of an entire country and people. Sure it might require international intervention to establish a DMZ like what happened towards the end of the Korean War (from a US perspective) but it would at least stop the senseless killing and greatly reduce the suffering that’s happening right now
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I agree. You can’t have civilians being slaughtered anywhere. Everyone has lost their fucking minds with mental gymnastics. It’s all bad. There are no excuses. Nothing to do with politics, defense spending, feelings, whataboutisms… All genocide and war is bad.
I wonder if it would tell you Ukraine is rich in African heritage
I like this “if you’d like up-to-date information” wiggling with General Party Line
Bing Copilot is also clearly Zionist
It’s totally worthless
Meme CEO: “Quick, fire everyone! This magic computerman can make memes by itself!”
Ok but what’s the meme they suggested? Lol
They just didn’t suggest any meme
Weird
I think it pulled a uno reverso on you. It provided the prompt and is patiently waiting for you to generate the meme.
I hate it when my computer tells me to run Fallout New Vegas for it.
“My brain doesn’t have enough RAM for that, Brenda!”, I answer to no avail.
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You didn’t ask the same question both times. In order to be definitive and conclusive you would have needed ask both the questions with the exact same wording. In the first prompt you ask about a number of deaths after a specific date in a country. Gaza is a place, not the name of a conflict. In the second prompt you simply asked if there had been any deaths in the start of the conflict; Giving the name of the conflict this time. I am not defending the AI’s response here I am just pointing out what I see as some important context.
Gaza is a place, not the name of a conflict
That’s not an accident. The major media organs have decided that the war on the Palestinians is “Israel - Hamas War”, while the war on Ukrainians is the “Russia - Ukraine War”. Why would you buy into the Israeli narrative in the first convention and not call the second the “Russia - Azov Battalion War” in the second?
I am not defending the AI’s response here
It is very reasonable to conclude that the AI is not to blame here. Its working from a heavily biased set of western news media as a data set, so of course its going to produce a bunch of IDF-approved responses.
Garbage in. Garbage out.
Because Ukraine has a single unified government excepting the occupied Donbas?
Calling it the Israel-Palestine war would be misleading because Israel hasn’t invaded the West Bank which has a separate/unrelated Palestine government.
To analogize oppositely, it would be real weird if China invaded Taiwan and people started calling it the Chinese civil war.
Ukraine has a single unified government
Ukraine had been in a state of civil war since 2014. That’s half the reason for the conflict. Donetsk separatists were governing the region adverse to the Ukrainian Feds for nearly a decade.
Calling it the Israel-Palestine war would be misleading because Israel hasn’t invaded the West Bank
Since Oct 7th, there have been repeated artillery bombardments of the West Bank by the IDF.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68006126
https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/israels-secret-air-war-gaza-west-bank-rcna126096
To analogize oppositely, it would be real weird if China invaded Taiwan and people started calling it the Chinese civil war.
Given their history, it would be more accurate to call it The Second Chinese Civil War.
The 2 things are not the same
Russia a country invaded Ukraine a country.
Israel a country was attacked by Hamas a terrorist group and in response invaded Palestine a country.
Way to put the cart before the horse! The origin of the current war in the mideast is the creation of Israel after the second world war. You can’t deny the role of the original land theft in discussing the situation, though i’m sure you weren’t trying to.
Imagine the King of England (now that we have one of those again) declaring Texas to be entirely the territory of Native Americans. What would white people do? And yet we act like the palestinians are unreasonable. Like, get fucked. It has nothing to do with racism of any sort and everything to do with all humans being pretty much worthless cunts. (Present company excepted of course. ;) )
That’s a valid point, but it’s not like the Jews never lived there, go far back enough and it’s a very different situation. That is what makes this entire conflict so difficult.
That is why I think it’s good to just look at current events.
Does it behave the same if you refer to it as “the war in Gaza”/“Israel-Palestine conflict” or similar?
I wouldn’t be surprised if it trips up on making the inference from Oct 7th to the (implicit) war.
Edit: I tested it out, and it’s not that - formatting the question the same for Russia-Ukraine and Israel-Palestine respectively does still yield those results. Horrifying.
Someone should realize that LLM’s aren’t always trained up to date on the latest and greatest of news. Ukraine’s conflict is two years running, and Gaza happened ~4½ months ago. It also really didn’t outright refuse, it just told the user to use search.
I don’t love it, but they’re probably trying to stay away from extra controversy that will get them canceled by the government.
They probably would have blacklisted the topic if they remembered. At least in America a portion of the population has forgotten about the conflict in the Ukraine because of Gaza and Gemini literally just got released to the general public.
This could be caused by the training dataset cutoff date. These models are not being trained on real time, so they don’t have information about recent events. War in Ukraine is lasting longer than 2 years already, and the current Gazan conflict is relatively recent. My quick search didn’t find what Gemini dataset cutoff date is.